Sesshin Lecture, No. 4
Tuesday Evening, August 4, 1970
San Francisco
In everyday life to observe precepts and in our practice to continue our zazen
looks different, but actually it is the same. In actual zazen, even though your
practice is not perfect, if you practice our way, there is enlightenment
because originally our practice is an expression of our true buddha-mind.
Because of your discrimination, you say your practice is not good. But, if we
do not discriminate in our practice, that is really the expression of our true
nature, which is buddha-nature.
In our everyday life, if we observe precepts even for a moment with our mind
which is changing always, then on the momentous changing mind, real moon of the
buddha-mind will appear: bodhi-mind will be there. So actually there is no
difference.
The point is, moment after moment we satisfy our practice and without
criticizing our mind too much, to do something which is good is the only way
for us. When you understand way-seeking mind, or buddha-mind, or bodhi-mind in
this way, actually everything is encouraging us to have buddha-mind or bodhisattva-mind,
which is to help others before we help ourselves. When you try to help others,
everything you have will give you a chance to help others. So whatever it is,
the things you see, things you hear will give you a chance to help others.
So that mind to help others will give you a big opportunity to treat everything
as Buddha's gift. And when you say, “Before we save ourselves, we will be free
from selfish ideas,” when you give up selfish ideas, there is a chance to have
buddha-mind. If you say, “Before we save ourselves, save others,” it looks dualistic.
But our understanding of bodhisattva-mind is not dualistic. It is extended.
Understanding of oneness of someone who gives and someone who receives—this is
the characteristic of our way. Practice and enlightenment is one. Someone who
saves and who is saved is one. So there is no problem in observing our way.
The precepts are also very clear. There are no precepts to observe and no one
who is observing precepts—no problem at all. If you say “precepts,” you are
precepts itself. And if you say “you,” you are already precepts. There are no
precepts and no one who observes precepts. In this way, we have to observe our
precepts, and we have to arise bodhisattva-mind, and we have to practice our
way.
Dogen Zenji says it is not because of your power of practicing zazen or power
of bodhisattva-mind that you attain enlightenment, that you become buddha. It
is not through power of practice and it is not through power of arising
bodhisattva-mind that you become buddha. And he says, even if you attain
enlightenment, you have to practice zazen. Even if you become buddha, you have
to extend bodhisattva-mind. Even if you become buddha, you have to observe
precepts.
That is actually why he said before you save yourself, you should save others.
So, this idea is beyond the idea of attainment—to be buddha or to observe
precepts. Usually, [laughs] you think, why you practice zazen is to attain
enlightenment, why you arise bodhisattva-mind is by the power of
bodhisattva-mind, you will be a buddha. By observing precepts you can practice
zazen and you will become a buddha. You will understand in that way.
But Dogen Zenji says it is not because of arising bodhisattva-mind that you
become buddha. And even if [laughs] you arise bodhisattva-mind, you should
continue the bodhisattva way. Before you save yourself, you should save others.
Even if you attain enlightenment, you should continue it. Do you understand?
You should continue it. Even if you have attained enlightenment, you should
continue it.
So bodhisattva-mind is not the way to attain buddhahood. Bodhisattva-mind is
mind which should be continued forever, whether you attain enlightenment or
not. Whether you are a buddha or not; anyway, bodhisattva-mind is the mind
which buddha and someone who is not yet buddha should continue.
You may think buddha is highest, and bodhisattva is next. And pratyeka1 and shravaka2, will follow. But [laughs] when we understand
bodhisattvas in that way, or when we understand our practice in that way, which
is important for us, enlightenment [laughs] or practice—which is important?
Which is better? Bodhisattva or buddha [laughs]? Very difficult to say. In one
way, maybe, bodhisattva is, if you become buddha, if that is the end of the
practice or end of everything [laughs].
So after you become buddha, what will you do [laughs, laughter]? Then that
buddha will not exist forever. And if there is somewhere to go, it may be that you
have to start again [laughs, laughter]. The bodhisattva way is the way which we
should continue anyway. So we say, “Before you save yourself, you should try to
save others.” The meaning is very deep. And the meaning will provide a very
easy approach. Very easy, but it is a lofty idea. There is no end to the bodhisattva
way.
So we transmit bodhisattva precepts to you [laughs]. We do not say, “buddha
precepts.” We say “bodhisattva precepts.” I don't want to discriminate between
Theravada way or so-called “Mahayana way,” but the true spirit of Buddha is
actually in the Mahayana way. And by Mahayana practice Buddhism could survive
for a long time.
So the four vows we recite every day are very important.3 And the
precepts transmitted from Buddha to us are very important. And to express the
meaning of Buddha's precepts, we call it “bodhisattva precepts” instead of
calling it “buddha precepts.” We can say “buddha precepts,” but to make this
point clear—the idea of non-duality and the idea of true duality—we use
“bodhisattva precepts.”
Even though we say “bodhisattva way,” we do not discriminate bodhisattva way from
Hinayana way. But if we call our precepts “bodhisattva,” then you will have a
much clearer understanding of precepts. And you will find it easier to observe.
And you will find a deeper meaning of observing precepts.
For us, even though all of us are descendants of Buddha—sons of Buddha—we call all
successive patriarchs “bodhisattvas.” Buddha is a bodhisattva. For us we
understand in that way. Bodhidharma is a bodhisattva. And Eka4 is a bodhisattva.
Dogen is a bodhisattva. And the precepts you will have in lay ordination are called
“bodhisattva transmission of precepts.”
For several nights, my talk is concentrated on this point of why you receive
bodhisattva precepts when you receive lay ordination. Recently I did not put
emphasis on Dogen Zenji's zazen practice, which is shikantaza. We do not
even say “shikantaza.” We just say “zazen.”
In comparison to zazen, to attain enlightenment, we call it shikantaza because we have no gaining idea in our practice. And in our practice, practice
and enlightenment is one. When you practice our zazen there is enlightenment.
We put emphasis on practice rather than enlightenment. The front gate for us is
practice. And, all Zen precepts are called “bodhisattva precepts.”
The precepts transmission you will receive in lay ordination is one in which it
says there is no difference between Rinzai precepts and Soto precepts. It is
bodhisattva precepts. This is a very important point. Not dualistic precepts.
And the precepts are always one with you. And always should be kept by you.
Even though you do not try to keep it, it is there.
So that is why I said last night5 you should say “yes.” You cannot say “no.”
[Laughs.] The point of my lecture was this point: bodhisattva practice—bodhisattva
precepts.
So on okechimyaku6 it says, “Busso shoden bosatsu daikai.”7 Bosatsu is “bodhisattva” in Japanese. And after you receive it, the most
important thing is to continue it. Moment after moment, you should say, “Yes, I
will.” [Laughs.] Moment after moment. And you should continue our practice,
even though you experience enlightenment experience. You should continue it.
That is the golden rule for all Zen students, whether you are a Rinzai student
or Soto student.
I don't want to repeat the same thing over and over. I think you have
understood. I think I have some more time, so if you have questions, please ask
me. Hai.
Student A: You said if you come to zazen in bodhisattva-mind, it's not the way
to enlightenment.
SR: [Laughs.]
Student A: I think I [1 word] that.
SR: Yeah. Many times, yes.
Student A: What is the way?
SR: Maybe so, but as I said right now, if you take literally that Zen is the
way to attain enlightenment, you will misunderstand our bodhisattva practice. The
bodhisattva way is the way which, regardless of whether you are buddha or not, you
should continue forever.
If you say “buddha way,” if you become buddha that will be the end. To make the
meaning of our practice clear, we say zazen is not to attain enlightenment. Do
you understand? You will be mistaken by saying you practice zazen to attain
enlightenment. So, when we practice zazen, we say beginner's mind is everything.
When you arise bodhisattva-mind, there is already buddha-mind. And it is
everything. So, I don't know which are more appropriate words: bodhisattva way
or buddha way. I don't know. Maybe, better to call it “bodhisattva way” rather
than “buddha way.” Buddha way is something like “dead way.” [Laughs.] Not
active—not alive. And it looks like we are not buddha. When we say “buddha,” we
are sentient beings. So there is a big gap between buddha and sentient beings.
But, when we say “bodhisattva,” bodhisattva includes all sentient beings. And
the bodhisattva way is especially for sentient beings. Do you understand? [laughs]
To make our way clear, I said, “Our way is not to attain enlightenment.” But we
do not reject enlightenment experience. We welcome [laughs, laughter] attaining
enlightenment. But if we say in that way, “Oh, I had a great experience! So my
practice is over. [Laughs, laughter.] I have done it!” [Said in an ironic
voice.] If you say so, you will actually lose your enlightenment.
So I think maybe you shouldn't say so. It is better not to say so. And it's
better to continue bodhisattva practice. Hai.
Student B: Is there a concrete meaning for “saving all sentient beings,” or is
doing zazen saving all sentient beings? Is there some other way to understand
what that means?
SR: Sentient? All? Saving sentient beings—You can say “to help.” You can start.
To save sentient beings is not just to give something to others, almsgiving or helping
people when they are in difficulty, materially or spiritually. But it is also
to make a freeway or to work in a factory; that is also actually to help
others. It does not mean only to help others just materially or spiritually. The
meaning is greater than that. To begin with, we should try to help others in
various ways—easy ways. And while you are doing this, that is practice. While
you are doing this, you will find out how difficult it is. Then you will improve
the way to help others. Naturally, you should practice zazen. Hai.
Student C: Is there a reason—or what is the reason why we should [6-10 words.]
Does it have something to do with the consciousness [1-2 words] or something
[1-3 words].
SR: Ahh. No. Here we practice in that way. But it does not mean you should continue
to eat as you eat here. It is a kind of training, maybe.
Student C: Is it a discipline to try to deprive yourself, say, when an urge to
eat certain food [1-2 words]—
SR: No.
Student C: —if you wanted to eat it. Like, you [1-2 words]—can that help your
practice or something [1-2 words]?
SR: Yes, yes. Nondiscrimination is very important in our eating practice.
[Laughs, laughter.] We Japanese people do not like raw vegetables so much.
Especially we don't eat beans without cooking. The smell is so strong [laughs,
laughter]! But in San Francisco zendo, as long as I am here [laughs, laughter],
I have to eat raw beans [laughs, laughter]— which have strong smell! All salad
looks like, to me, green beans. If you cook it, it has not much strong smell.
Good flavor [laughs]. If you don't cook, all the salad looks to me like green
beans [laughs, laughter]. But we should not discriminate [laughs, laughter].
Non-discrimination is very important [laughs, laughter]. Hai.
Student D: Roshi, why do we eat the banana and throw away the skin?
SR: [Laughs.] I don't know. [Laughter.] Maybe very difficult to eat. I tried
[laughs, laughter], but it was too difficult. And actually, I think if you eat
it, your tummy will stop, [laughs, laughter]. You will have a hard time in your
restroom next morning [laughs, laughter]. So that is too much. Hai.
Student E: Roshi, last night did I understand you correctly—getting back to the
business of trying to help others—that shouldn't be with the conscious mind?
It should just be what it is—just don't bother with it [?]—a sort of natural
thing [?]?
SR: Yeah, you know, it is like—when you help them, you don't have much problem
because you are a man who is helping someone. But for those who are helped, there
will be some problem there. If you receive something from someone, if you
change your position, you will find out why. And if you are conscious about
giving something, then it will create some problem unnecessarily. In this
point, American people are very good, I think. If you give something to
someone, that's all [laughs]. I find many things outside of my room. I don't
know who gave it to me. They just give it to me. So, I appreciate their
kindness in its true sense. But if I know who gave it to me, I have, of course,
no bad feelings, so I don't mind so much whether I know who gave it to me or I
don't know. It doesn't matter so much. But I think it is better, if it is
possible, if you can do it without a dualistic idea of giving or “I am giving
something to others.” Hai. [Sentence finished. Tape turned over. First part of
student's question not recorded.]
Student F: —in practice. In this context, I'd like to understand effort,
because it's also said that the way is effortless. Right practice.
SR: Ah. Right practice. Yeah.
Student F: That's what I'd like to know. Is right practice effortless?
SR: Effortless?
Student F: Yes. With no effort.
SR: No effort with a gaining idea. Effort maybe to give up gaining ideas.
Effort to continue it without dualistic ideas: just to do it. That kind of
effort is always important. Hai.
Student G: Roshi, would you say something about shila—the bodhisattva concept
of [1 word].
Student H: That was Sanskrit.
SR: Bodhisattva?
Student G: Shila—morality. [6-8 words] bodhisattva way.
SR: In contrast to—in Sanskrit [laughs, laughter]? I don't know Sanskrit.
“Bodhisattva” is Sanskrit, I know, but—I am sorry.
Student G: The bodhisattva concept of morality.
SR: Ah, concept of morality.
Student G: Yeah.
SR: Morality is—it is more than morality. If you see our precepts, it is
exactly morality, which you should observe as a human being. But the
bodhisattva way is more than that. That is why I have to explain it, why I
explained so far. If it is morality, if you read the precepts: “Don't kill,” “Don't
steal.” Or, “Don't speak ill of others.” If you read in that way, literally,
that is morality. And actually, most people are observing morality to some
extent. That is morality.
But the bodhisattva way includes morality but more than that. If you observe it
in a dualistic sense, it is morality. If you understand the bodhisattva way
deeper than that, it is, maybe, religious activity. So moral world, religious
world, there are two or more.
Maybe your question arose because I said intuitively, or without any idea of
observing it. But it does not mean to ignore the moral codes. Okay? Hai.
Student I: What is suffering? What relieves suffering?
SR: In short, to expect something which you cannot expect is the cause of
suffering. We want to live longer, but we cannot live so long. Maybe one
hundred years or mostly less than that. But we want to live more than that.
There we have suffering. We want to meet someone who we love [laughs], but it
is not always possible. Some days you have to be separated from someone who you
love. And you will meet some who you do not like so much [laughing]. That is
very true. You say you don't like him or like her. But you must ask her, how
she feels. Then it is very difficult. Even though you love her, she may say no
[laughs, laughter]. That is a cause of suffering. So, in short, [laughs,
laughter] the things do not go as you expect. That is suffering.
And so, how to get out of suffering is to have a quiet mind. That you can eat
green peas [laughs, laughter] is how to get out of suffering. If your mind is
calm and very soft, you can eat it, and actually it is very good [laughs,
laughter]. So we say:
Jiki ni oite to naru mono wa,
ho ni oitemo mata to nari.8
A man who does not discriminate food will not discriminate in our dharma either.
You will not say, “I cannot observe this precept. But this is a very good precept
[laughing, laughter]. Very convenient for me.” To criticize someone—we use
precepts to criticize someone: “'Don't speak ill of others.' You see? What did
you say now? You shouldn't criticize me [laughs, laughter], because the precept
says don't criticize anyone.” That is not how we observe precepts. Hai.
Student J [DC]: Sometimes when I've heard definitions of suffering by Rahula in What the Buddha Taught,9 and that doctor who spoke at Zen
Center a couple of years ago— Dr.—
Student K: Conze [?]?
David: No, no. That young guy who went to Ceylon.
SR: Uh-huh.
David: They define suffering in such a big way, you know. It was, like, is your
understanding of suffering including everything: good and bad, happy and
unhappy—all experiences?
SR: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, teaching of suffering covers almost the whole of Buddhism.
Student K: Burns.
SR: Hmm?
Student L: Burn. [Laughs, laughter.]
SR: Oh. Yeah. Dr. Burns, yeah.
David: Could you repeat what he thought on [2-4 words]?
SR: No, I cannot. My mind is not so explicit—it is a big topic to speak about.
I know that much. But, in one word, that is how we suffer. That teaching covers
almost the whole teaching.
Duhkha, sukha—our life could be divided into renunciation from suffering
and suffering. But it is actually one. Because it is one, the teaching of
suffering covers the teaching of enlightenment.
Student M: I thought you said that we should begin by practicing as if we were
shopping for things?
SR: Yeah.
Student M: How did that fit in with buying the rotten vegetables? Would the bad
vegetables be what you would buy [?]?
SR: [Laughs, laughter.] No, at that time I had no idea of buying something. It
is a kind of—my special practice, maybe. That is my habit or feeling. When I
see good, fresh vegetables and fresh apples and old, rotten apples, I feel if I
don't buy it, if I don't eat it right now, no one will buy it, so he must throw
it away. If I buy it, that apple will help us. But if I don't, for that apple
there is no chance to serve its purpose [laughs, laughter]. Immediately I feel that
way, so I cannot help buying bad ones first and leaving good ones for someone because
many people will like them. Maybe if you work in the kitchen you will have that
kind of feeling.
Student M: Wouldn't you then always buy bad things [?]?
SR: No, not always.
Student M: Bad [1 word], bad [1 word].
SR: [Laughs, laughter.] No. No, not always. Especially food. If I buy a
motorcar, I want to buy a brand new perfect one [laughs, laughter]. But the
more you have knowledge of something, you will be like me when I buy some
apples or something. Before you have not much knowledge about it, you will buy
something good first. If you have good knowledge of cars, even though it
doesn't look like so good, but if you know how to mend it, you will buy it
because maybe it is cheaper. And you know how to make good use of it. So, if
your mind is very kind and very clear, you will observe in that way without
having superficial discrimination. Some questions? Hai.
Student N: When you say “attaining enlightenment,” are you saying gradual
enlightenment always? And when you talk about enlightenment experiences, do you
mean experiences that are an encouragement to our practice?
SR: Why I say so is because you say “enlightenment.” But mostly it is not a great
enlightenment. It is many small enlightenments—not a big one which covers every
experience. Enlightenment, like Dogen Zenji described, is the enlightenment
which covers everything. No one can get out of his enlightenment [laughs]. It
is so big.
Student O: Can you explain the difference between koan practice and shikantaza practice?
SR: I don't know koan practice so well. But for us, “koan” originally meant official
statements or rules—issued from the government. So something which you observe—
absolute rules or statements of enlightenment for Zen. So how you find out the
absolute truth in each Zen story is koan practice. But for us, our everyday
life is already a big koan [laughs, laughter]. So, we do not stick to some
traditional special koans. Some questions? Hai.
Student P: [3-4 words] the difference between the bodhisattva-mind and the
buddha-mind? [4-8 words.] Is the buddha-mind something that occurs only after
death?
SR: No. In its true sense, there must not be any difference between
bodhisattva-mind and buddha-mind. Should be the same. But for a long time Buddhism
was mistaken or misunderstood. After a long time they found out the true
meaning of precepts—sutras. And they started to use the word “bodhisattva”
instead of “buddha.” They put emphasis on the bodhisattva stage rather than the
buddha stage, which is perfect. The bodhisattva stage is not perfect, but the idea
of buddha is also fully included—maybe more advanced buddha [laughs]. The
meaning of words may have been deeper when the old Buddhists called Buddha
“Buddha.”
Student P: In what sense, then, does zazen help others?
SR: Help others? Yeah.
Student P: I was assuming that it only helps—
SR: —yourself.
Student P: —yourself.
SR: Yeah. No. No—definitely not. Maybe, as I said right now, because you do not
know yourself so much, and you don't know what you are doing to others so much,
but what others do to you, you know very much [laughs]. And actually, you are
doing the same thing to others [laughs, laughter]. If you realize that, you
know, you will think [laughs].
Student Q: Is it necessary to accept freedom as a form of suffering?
SR: Freedom. The idea of freedom or— ?
Student Q: The experience of freedom.
SR: Experience of freedom.
Student Q: Yes. Is that also suffering when you [2-4 words]?
SR: I think so. You may say freedom is also a cause of suffering because you
have fear of losing freedom. So you feel that you should protect your freedom
[laughs, laughter]. Then, [laughing] freedom will cause some trouble for you.
Hai.
Student Q: Isn't that the original discrimination—enlightenment versus
non-enlightenment or freedom versus non-freedom? Isn't that the original
discrimination?
SR: Yeah, freedom—maybe so. Some idea which is dualistic is, anyway, the cause
of the problem because it makes a pair of opposites. There are no words which
mean something without any opposite idea. So if you stick to one side, you will
cause trouble—sticking to one side. When you are in a position which includes
both sides, or an understanding in which you can include both sides, that is
how to be free from suffering. Hai.
Student R: The Theravadan scriptures talk about many different levels of
meditation. Does zazen include all of these, or is it different?
SR: “Include” is very vague. Our practice is a foundation of those practices.
Without our practice, they don’t work. If it is actually stepladder-like
practice, it will create problems. It should be one practice, and it should be
a different experience of one practice. Then those various steps will work—will
help. So if you open your eyes, and if you understand our practice and see
those stages of attainment, it makes sense.
Mmm. Just a moment. I think I haven't any more time. Do I have some more time?
Student: 9:10 [?].
SR: Oh. Okay. Thank you.
_______________
1 pratyeka-yāna: attaining enlightenment by and for only
oneself, the end result of which is becoming a pratyeka-buddha. It is
one of the three vehicles (triyāna) that can bring one to nirvāna: shrāvaka-yāna, pratyeka-yāna, and bodhisattva-yāna.
2 shrāvaka-yāna: seeking personal enlightenment by listening
to the dharma and gaining insight, the end result of which is becoming an
arhat.
3 "Beings are numberless; I vow to save them.
Delusions are inexhaustible; I vow to end them.
Buddha gates are boundless; I vow to enter them.
Buddha's way is unsurpassable; I vow to become it."
4 Dazu Huike (Taiso Eka): 487-593. Second patriarch of Zen in China.
Dharma successor of Bodhidharma.
5 SR-70-08-03.
6 okechimyaku: a genealogy of Zen succession. (See also
SR-71-06-09, p. 9.)
7 Busso shōden bosatsu daikai—Busso: Buddha and ancestors; shō: "right" or "true" (as in Shōbōgenzō); den:
transmitting; bosatsu: bodhisattva; daikai: precepts for monks
and nuns. Hence, "great precepts for bodhisattvas correctly transmitted by
buddhas and ancestors," or, more traditionally, "bodhisattva precepts
of the correct transmission of the Buddha ancestors."
8 Jiki (food); ni oite (about); tō (absolute or
equality); naru (become); mono wa (person), hō (dharma); ni oitemo (about); mata (also); tō (absolute or equality); nari (end-of-sentence marker). Suzuki-rōshi is
referring to Dōgen-zenji's "Fushukuhanpō" ("The Dharma
for Taking Food"), from Eihei (Dai) Shingi, Line 1. See T. D.
Leighton and S. Okumura, Dōgen's Pure Standards for the Zen Community,
Albany: SUNY, 1996, p. 83. [See also SR-70-08-15.]
9 Walpola Sri Rahula, What the Buddha Taught (Bedford: Gordon
Fraser Gallery, 1959).
Source: Original City Center tape transcribed and checked by Bill Redican
(11/29/00). Miyagawa Keishi-san kindly provided assistance with the translation
of Japanese terms. Lightly edited for readability by Wendy Pirsig and Peter
Ford (3/2021).
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